2020 Capri build

[Martin0660]

Going to share some stuff of my upgrades going into the 2020 season.

First thing i have going on is the new short block build.

Found a decent core, had it how tanked, washed, and sonic checked.

I did not sonic check my previous block. We know they are thin in places, obviously realized the last one was thinner than though when it cracked. This block checked out pretty well, likely as good as you are going to find a passenger car block. We will move the bores slightly to the thicker sides now that we have data.

as a reference I broke a chunk out of the old block and it was .095 where it cracked. That block was only .110 on the front of #4 before boring. (.095 + .015 as half of .030 over bore).

Really happy with this as a starting point.

[Martin0660]

After the block was cleaned and plugs installed I brought it home to fill.

my last ones I’ve been using Hard Block. Frankly I’ve not been overly impressed. For this one I used Rokblock from Competition Products ... https://www.competitionproducts.com/Rokblock-Professional-Engine-Block-Filler-25-lbs/productinfo/ROK/

Really happy with this product, it flowed really well, and looks like it sticks very well. Every time I pull my water pump plug you can see the cylinder,. This stuff it just filled that and leveled.

[Martin0660]

Other interesting things going on this year...

im going to change my intercooler set up to a better intercooler and go from 2 1/2 to 3” charge pipes. When I put all that stuff on the car I really never expected this car to go much better than 10.90’s ... at the power level I’ve been, I think the Chinese intercooler might be a bit of a choke.

the other big change as this comes along is that I ordered the BHJ fixture plate to cut o-ring grooves in the block deck and a receiver groove in the head. I’m going to a copper head gasket with stainless steel o-ring. This should help my cylinder sealing that wants to push a head gasket every 20 or so passes.

new lower radiator support with built in intercooler mounts ...

[Dan B.]

All this racecar talk is gonna make Troy want to install the two step..........

.....or not.

[Martin0660]

All this racecar talk is gonna make Troy want to install the two step..........


he seems pretty resilient against it with the ball busting Joe and I give him here and worse in person.

He started a Facebook group “Troys against 2 Steps”.

[yeahloh95]

troy wants 2 steps but troys 8.8 says please wait till spool and new axles go in first ....

[TooFast98Cobra]

Can u run an A to W ? U on a race fuel? I cant remember

[Martin0660]

I can run A/W ... the problem is for True Street we can’t add ice except after the cruise and before 1st passthen it’s done. My IAT is under 130 degrees on a 90 degree day with A/A so it’s not a big deal. The intercooler I have is just likely on the small side for the power I’m making now.

yes Race Gas, running Renegade Pro 110+, same as C12 but less cost. I’m likely going to switch to their version of C16 for next season.

[Martin0660]

Pulled out my old intercooler set up ... with a 3” thick XS Racing chinese intercooler, and 2 1/2” tubes it’s pretty amazing it went 9.80’s

[Martin0660]

Got my lower radiator support in, trimmed out a bunch of bumper and other stuff so I can get the air ducted to the whole intercooler ... waiting for the core to come

[somethingclever]

Pulled out my old intercooler set up ... with a 3” thick XS Racing chinese intercooler, and 2 1/2” tubes it’s pretty amazing it went 9.80’s


Bob did you datalog the pressure delta across it by chance?

[Martin0660]

Bob did you datalog the pressure delta across it by chance?

no, I don’t have anything to log across the core and won’t. My boost control does what it needs to do to maintain pressure in the intake manifold. Whatever the turbo needs to do to make that pressure. Data is great, but it’s easy enough to get hung up in your shorts with too many sensors.

[Pure Stock]

troy hates 2 steps and troys 8.8 says please keep me oem ....

I kinda figured

[Pure Stock]

Pulled out my old intercooler set up ... with a 3” thick XS Racing chinese intercooler, and 2 1/2” tubes it’s pretty amazing it went 9.80’s

That just looks heavy

[Martin0660]

I kinda figured

oh shit ... someone put some lotion on Troys burns

[Martin0660]

That just looks heavy

unfortunately, what’s going in is heavier ... needed evil in my game

[Martin0660]

New versus old intercooler ... surprising the weight difference was only 5.6# heavier so about 4# added to the nose with this.

lets hope it adds some power, lol

mocked up roughly in place too.

[Martin0660]

Nothing is ever a bolt in with my deal. After cutting out bumper and cutting up and reselling mounts I’m thrilled with intercooler mounting. Installed and locked down ...

[Martin0660]

Stupid expensive, but got to love new tools. BHJ fixture plate to cut o-ring grooves in the deck and (more important) marching receiver grooves in the head. Should help with my sealing issues

[terryna]

Will be fun followhttp://juragan.club/assets/8/o.png

[Martin0660]

New block is bored so I could order new pistons ...almost a shame to hide them under an iron head

[Martin0660]

Not sure if this will work, but block rough bored. The block filler sure changes how it machines

https://photos.app.goo.gl/mXecgrogW7MERq8u5

[Martin0660]

SCE Pro copper ... looks innocent enough

[black 94]

Just out of pure curiosity just for knowledge purposesdoes it seem more rigid while machining? Didnt u use a different filler this time? Did it seem better?

[Martin0660]

Machinist said you can tell it’s filled. Said “it doesn’t sound hollow”.

yes, I used a filler called RokBlock from Competition Products versus the standby Hard Block.

i guess we will see long term, but as far as actually filling the block this stuff was MUCH easier to work with. Hard Block always feels like it’s fighting you and the iron stuff falls out of suspension. The. rokBlock is more soupy and pours really easy. Went into all the gaps and is claimed to adhere better. It goes off in 15minutes so it’s seems sort of epoxy based.

on mine the water pump insets in the block so I need to use a plug to make space for the pump. With HardBlock every time I pull that plug out, the filler crumbles out behind the plug and #1 jug. ... with the Rokblock I pulled the plug and the stuff was perfect and adhered.

in the end we may never know. We found the old block was .095 where it split. This one is now .130 on thinest spot. I guess if the thicker block splits, we know it’s crap, lol.

In the end we will never really know. I have a buddy that fills his blocks to the deck and still splits them. He is on methanol so can get away without water but makes 800 hp or more. Talking with people I trust, the consensus is the splits start at the top of the cylinder and work down. I’m not filled the top 1 1/2 under the deck so ...

my last block beside the split, the holes was still round so the filler does something anyway.

we are also changing up the ring package for this bullet.

[Martin0660]

Picked up a few aluminum bends of a few styles to see what works best to work with.

3” charge pipe is pretty big, lol.

[Martin0660]

Bore, deck, line hone, etc. all done on the new bullet. Ready for final hone, then plan to cut the o-rings sometime over the holidays. Making progress anyway.

[mgtf289]

I can run A/W ... the problem is for True Street we can’t add ice except after the cruise and before 1st passthen it’s done. My IAT is under 130 degrees on a 90 degree day with A/A so it’s not a big deal. The intercooler I have is just likely on the small side for the power I’m making now.

yes Race Gas, running Renegade Pro 110+, same as C12 but less cost. I’m likely going to switch to their version of C16 for next season.

are you running sensors that may be a problem with leaded fuel and how do you handle that

[Martin0660]

are you running sensors that may be a problem with leaded fuel and how do you handle that

the only thing affected is my wideband sensor.

iput a fresh one on to start the season, and keep one around in case I make a change that I want a good look at the tune. Otherwise I usually put a fresh one in for the good fall air.

sensors are just a cost of doing it to me. Once I’m dialed in the spring, I’m usually good through the summer without one,

[mgtf289]

Thanx for response. Tim wants me to go to 110 and I was concerned. A friend of mine says he allows his sensor to heat up before starting and has no issues

[Martin0660]

The lead will get it sooner or later.

my junk does not use the wideband for anything except a gauge unless I give it authority to do something so it’s along for the ride most times.

typically I come out in the spring with combo changes and use it to dial in the tune. Through the summer I’m just racing so it’s just a reference.

im surprised yours isn’t on race gas already, I think it’s a great safety

[mgtf289]

I’ve been running Sunoco 104 unleaded but Tim wants 110. At PRI I found Renegade 109 unleaded that I may try

[Martin0660]

You can get Renegade from Spray it Racing in mount pleasant. He does a big order in spring, but carries a lot and will get you what you need.

i but the Pro 110+ by the 55 gallon drum to mostLy make a season. This year I’m moving to 116+ or a mix. I considered going to the Ignite but my fuel system would be a real challenge.

[SlowSix]

You ever get tired of dumping money in a weird engine choice Bob?

Considering dropping some more coin on mine over the winter (new turbo, re worked hotside), but starting to wonder if it is worth it anymore and have thought many a times about going to some sort of mod motor.

[Martin0660]

You ever get tired of dumping money in a weird engine choice

constantly ....

when I split the block at the end of the season I asked myself WTF was I doing ... the reality is, I am heavy into this oddity, and you know the TurboFord crowd .., stuff I own is worth pennies on the dollar resale, so what can I do? To start over with other platform I won’t get the down payment on anything else out of my stuff, every option I considered is a $10k starting point to get into, and keeping what I have is a couple of grand ... at a minimum, I had to build a new short block to even get anything out of the parts there.

I really looked at going Coyote, but the reality is, I would need a power adder to get back to where I’m at now, and it’s not cheap to build one that can race the way I do.

its a trap, it is what it is ... a few moments of glory mixed with a whole lot of suck ... the feeling passes when it does good, but no doubt I’m playing with a dinosaur.

[SlowSix]

constantly ....

when I split the block at the end of the season I asked myself WTF was I doing ... the reality is, I am heavy into this oddity, and you know the TurboFord crowd .., stuff I own is worth pennies on the dollar resale, so what can I do? To start over with other platform I won’t get the down payment on anything else out of my stuff, every option I considered is a $10k starting point to get into, and keeping what I have is a couple of grand ... at a minimum, I had to build a new short block to even get anything out of the parts there.

I really looked at going Coyote, but the reality is, I would need a power adder to get back to where I’m at now, and it’s not cheap to build one that can race the way I do.

its a trap, it is what it is ... a few moments of glory mixed with a whole lot of suck ... the feeling passes when it does good, but no doubt I’m playing with a dinosaur.

Having the same struggle.
Really need to drop some coin to get my turbo kit right....
But hate to keep putting money in this stupid setup.

On the other hand I'll spend twice to three times as much to start over.

[Martin0660]

Setting ring gaps ...

[yeahloh95]

Should be making tractor noises soon

[Martin0660]

Should be making tractor noises soon

no instant gratification with my engine builds ... one last bearing clearance check, then off to cut of o-rings ... hopefully able to start assembly in a couple of weeks.

[Pure Stock]

Looking good Bob! Be ready for spring?

[Martin0660]

Be ready for spring?

should be ok. Pulled the plug on the idea of going to BRADENTON, but should be ready for the season up here

[Martin0660]

After more delay than I even want to remember, finally picked up my block and head cut for o-rings and receiver grooves. Delay wasn’t anyone’s fault, we just had some issues with the BHJ tooling working with the BHJ fixture plate. Had to make an adapter, but now it exists so it will go quicker in the future.

block needs one more wash, then assembly can finally start

[Pure Stock]

Looks more reliable. What’s the tune look like for this year? 10.0?

[Martin0660]

Looks more reliable. What’s the tune look like for this year? 10.0?

This year I don’t see a lot of motivation to run the car flat out.

The only 10.00 stuff I have on the Calendar are NMCA at Norwalk and NMRA at Bowling Green (stick shootout). Not going to chase their stuff very much.
Between Mason Dixon and Dragway 42 there is a lot of 6.50 index racing I could compete in pretty well.
UMTR was late coming out with their schedule, but they have a pretty full list of stick bracket racing.
Renegade has 3 races at Thompson this year for 10.50 index class.

it looks like we won’t have the King of Street stuff at Keystone any more based on the schedule.

It make a lot of sense for me to tial in the car on 6.50 1/8th mile (10.15 1/4) to 10.50 1/4 mile (6.70 1/8th mile) and I could race just about any of that stuff when it’s time. As much as I don’t like 1/8th mile racing, I really like index racing and that 6.50 stuff is a lot of dates between the 2 tracks.

[yeahloh95]

looks like you will be up and running soon .

[Ares]

Oh the beginnings of fresh engine porn :2thumbs:

Reminds me that I need to get back at it again on mine. Last few months have sucked.

[Pure Stock]

This year I don’t see a lot of motivation to run the car flat out.

The only 10.00 stuff I have on the Calendar are NMCA at Norwalk and NMRA at Bowling Green (stick shootout). Not going to chase their stuff very much.
Between Mason Dixon and Dragway 42 there is a lot of 6.50 index racing I could compete in pretty well.
UMTR was late coming out with their schedule, but they have a pretty full list of stick bracket racing.
Renegade has 3 races at Thompson this year for 10.50 index class.

it looks like we won’t have the King of Street stuff at Keystone any more based on the schedule.

It make a lot of sense for me to tial in the car on 6.50 1/8th mile (10.15 1/4) to 10.50 1/4 mile (6.70 1/8th mile) and I could race just about any of that stuff when it’s time. As much as I don’t like 1/8th mile racing, I really like index racing and that 6.50 stuff is a lot of dates between the 2 tracks.

Any plans to fill the water jackets with something to fill the voids? I vaguely remember a conversation about it.

[Martin0660]

Any plans to fill the water jackets with something to fill the voids?

last block was half filled with Hard Block. New block is nearly 2/3rd filled with a different product, Rok Block from Competition products. It’s a different product for sure, flows much better, sets scary fast, and seemed to get everywhere. To be seen if it’s better, but the machinist said it machined like it was solid, especially noticed doing the final hone.

you can see the fill level in this picture.

[somethingclever]

holy crap it's half an engine........


Looks great Bob!

[Martin0660]

New shortblock is mostly together. It is actually sealed up but didn’t take a picture with the oil pan on.

need to fit the o-rings then ready for paint

[yeahloh95]

so tractor noises this weekend then ?

[Martin0660]

so tractor noises this weekend then ? a bit to go yet...

still don’t have clutch back and need that to index bell and such.

once I get it all together and in I still need to fab up all new charge pipes.

o-rings are in deck this morning ...

[yeahloh95]

i might actually beat you to be back up and running with my new mods ???

[Martin0660]

i might actually beat you to be back up and running with my new mods ???

likely I guess ... short block is done, but I’m waiting on my clutch back ... I need the clutch (technically flywheel) to set up my adapter plate and index the bell.

[Pure Stock]

i might actually beat you to be back up and running with my new mods ???

What? New mods?

[Pure Stock]

likely I guess ... short block is done, but I’m waiting on my clutch back ... I need the clutch (technically flywheel) to set up my adapter plate and index the bell.

Are they working at Black Magic?

[Martin0660]

Are they working at Black Magic?

quietly ... supply chain issues, but working out what they can I guess.

[Martin0660]

What? New mods?

Let’s hope it’s the 2 step install

[yeahloh95]

What? New mods?

just some injectors and stuff maybe a new tune

[Pure Stock]

just some injectors and stuff maybe a new tune

Word on the streets there is a grabber blue ‘17 that wants a shot on the street from a dig.

[Martin0660]

Picked up my bullet yesterday, got it painted today, front trim done, bellhousing indexed ....

[Martin0660]

Got the bellhousing pretty dead on....

next learning lesson, how to anneal a copper head gasket

[yeahloh95]

mine has been pushed back some . you might end up ready before me , mine was to go on dyno this week we will see

[Martin0660]

Big learning curve with this copper head gasket ... annealed it, copper spray coated, installed and torqued ... I’ve got visions of water coming out of everywhere, lol

[Martin0660]

And assembled ....

[Fast Gypsy]

Looks Good, Runs Good. Will be a Holy Terror.

[Martin0660]

The eagle has landed ...

[Martin0660]

Got the hot side intercooler piping done, got the cold side figured out but now waiting on parts, lol ...

Hoping I get clutch back soon

[yeahloh95]

you are getting close all of my parts are here so maybe up and running this week hope you hear tractor noises soon

[excell]

What a gorgeous engine! What did you torque the heads to?

[Martin0660]

I use modified studs and a copper gasket but 90 ft/lb

[somethingclever]

Bob,

I don't know anything about how copper gaskets are supposed to work. Thanks for the detailed pictures.

So the deck and the head surface both get female grooves?

Looks that way from the pics?

If so, what is the reason the grooves will hold more cylinder pressure?

[Martin0660]

So the deck and the head surface both get female grooves?

the deck and head have grooves machined. That’s the big deal that those grooves be precisely aligned.

the deck has stainless steel wire inserted in it to create the o-ring. This wire stands proud of the deck. First that grabs the copper gasket creating a fire ring. It further extrudes the o ring into the receiver groove in the head licking it all in place. In theory, it’s a locked fire ring now.

more important in my case, if the head lifts, the protrusion into the head should still seal and not push pressure into water jackets.

likely a picture is worth 1000 words

[excell]

90ft/lbs is less than I expected actually! Isn't that factory spec?

Not sure how much room there really is for this, but have you thought about adding cross bolts? May not be enough material in the block to grab on to make any meaningful difference.

Would love to meet you at the track if we're ever able to get out this year.

[Martin0660]

You really can’t increase torque without distorting the deck further. That’s the big problem with this platform, the deck just isn’t strong enough with big boost.

there is no logical way to add fasteners, we sure have looked at most options.

im usually at the track most test and tunes except when I’m not, lol. Hit me up when you might go

[Martin0660]

Stuffs coming together ... cold side pipes mostly sorted out. 3” is a bitch, lol

dug out my transmission and got it ready to go in. Clutch is done and on its way back to me so that’s exciting too.

[excell]

Looking good. Love that trans!

[Martin0660]

And my clutch is back from rebuild ... at least I’ve gor things to do this weekend

[blackfive-o]

I gotta hand it to you man, 9's in a four banger!

[Martin0660]

Well, it runs ...:biglaugh:

https://youtu.be/CZQeUbRxbMQ

i got 2 heat cycles on it, ready to retorque the head and check valve lash.

a couple of things to clean up, wideband doesn’t seem to be working and something is up with the fuel pump

[86GT]

Thanks for the update

[Martin0660]

Got my absorbant material today, got my diaper installed, and backed the junk out of the garage under its own power...

needs washed desperately, but it runs and moves.

[Martin0660]

And I’m ready ... looking at my options to test this weekend

[THE BIG KOALA]

Ready to roll

[Dan B.]

ready for new video of tractor sounds.

[Martin0660]

Got signed up for a test Saturday so I can shake it down

[TooFast98Cobra]

Looks great Robert

[Martin0660]

Seems crazy to load up for the first time at the end of May, but in the trailer and ready to go tomorrow.

new truck pulls wonderful. Two things that was big upgrades, the 8.4 screen rear camera is silly good versus the one in my ‘15 ... real tow mirrors are incredible compared to the clip ones I used before.

excitex to get on the highway tomorrow

[Ares]

Have fun and smoke some rubber but not the clutch :3gears:

Tow mirrors were a massive upgrade on my last truck. They do make things so much easier with an enclosed car trailer. Just don't leave the Moose antlers out when not towing.

[yeahloh95]

how was mason last weekend I saw some good passes on fb

[Dan B.]

These are cetainly odd times. There are fencing that need leaned on and Troy can't even go to help.

[yeahloh95]

I am having withdrawel

[Martin0660]

how was mason last weekend I saw some good passes on fb

could of hot lapped a car to death if you wanted to... I made 7 passes and let it cool a lot.

got the slick broke in, got the clutch broke in, car made passes, nothing fell off, and I drove it into the garage.

clutch was pretty loose most of the day. Got my data downloaded and made the first adjustment yesterday. I guess it’s ready to go

here is a video of a decent pass. You can hear the clutch in the middle of the gears, it’s over the base, but before the counter weight locks up ...

https://youtu.be/OSddEPRnSZY

[yeahloh95]

seems like a great first day at the track this year